Facing up to New Delhi’s hostile intent
By Dr Shireen M Mazari • Dec 26th, 2008 • Category: Politics, Worth A Second Look • 38 CommentsThanks to the pusillanimity shown by our leaders ever since the Mumbai acts of terrorism, Pakistan is being squeezed by so-called friends and foe alike. For India its own failures at Mumbai and the growing question mark over the death of the Anti-Terror Cell head, Hemant Karkare, leading to the possible role of Hindu extremists in the Mumbai carnage have made it imperative that all efforts be directed at shifting the focus to Pakistan and the internationally targeted religious groups like Lashkar-e-Taiba. After all, such accusations would find a ready international audience – and that is exactly what has happened – with no questions asked. In addition, the present Pakistani leadership also played into Indian hands by its bumbling and confusion – first over the whole shameful “sending of the DG ISI” incident, followed by the UN Security Council fiasco and finally the absurd and ignorant claims of ‘technical fault’ on the incident of Indian airplane intrusions into targeted Pakistani airspace. Now the final stage of the Indian game plan is to deliver the so-called Kasab letter to the Pakistan High Commission, after the disinformation campaign regarding the Faridkot link!
With a non-questioning international media and eager foreign allies, India has not only shifted focus away from serious issues relating to its own failings and the role of rogue elements in its army alongside Hindu extremists in incidents of terrorism; it has also created a more favourable environment for carrying out surgical strikes against targets in Pakistan. Ironically, the only possible spanner in the cleverly crafted Indian design against Pakistan has come from soberly questioning domestic sources. However, let there be no doubt that India is going to carry out surgical strikes, probably beginning with AJK. After all, the extraordinary and unscheduled Envoys Conference can only have been called to contain the diplomatic fallout of such strikes.
Two developments can perhaps prevent these surgical strikes: first, the international community, especially India’s powerful allies like the US, shift their pressure from Pakistan to India and make it clear that any military action against Pakistan would be unacceptable. Second, that the Pakistan government surrenders to all Indian demands.
A third factor India is also having to consider is the level of success it can attain in these strikes – that is, can they be carried out successfully including the safe return of the aircraft? Missiles would be a less attractive option – although more furtive – for the Indians since the circular error probabilities (CEPs) are not low enough as Indian guidance systems are not that efficient and precise. Pakistani aircraft and missiles can ensure that India does not succeed in its strikes, but for that the political will of Islamabad has to be resolute. This is the chink in our armour the Indians are counting on, and to ensure our lack of rapid response, Mullen has been sent to persuade Pakistan to desist from responding militarily to Indian strikes against Pakistani-AJK targets.
Incidentally, India has been readying itself for surgical strikes against Pakistan since post-nuclearisation, through its Cold Start Doctrine. This doctrine seeks to gain a military advantage through rapid, surgical strikes from the air, ground and sea, before the international community moves in to prevent a Pakistani response. This is exactly what India is counting on right now. So coming to the two possible means of deterring Indian military adventurism, the most critical is the role of Indian allies like the US.
This is where Pakistan is going to come under massive pressure – in fact it already is. Mullen’s visit is one such move to persuade Pakistan to allow India to attack certain targets within the country. But the pressure was set in motion immediately the Mumbai carnage began – even before any information was available. One has been critical of the Indian media, but the US and British media (especially the BBC) were no better. It was almost as if the Indian government had the media handling in place before Mumbai actually happened! Then we had Condi Rice fuming and frothing at Pakistan and Obama once again talking of strikes inside Pakistan by India; and the British leadership jumping into the imperial role they still yearn for. All in all, Mumbai has offered the perfect opportunity for these players to seek fulfilment of their agendas within Pakistan – that is, target the nuclear assets and bring the country to its knees.
The US media histrionics against Pakistan are rising incessantly and the confusion and bumblings inside the government of Pakistan are sending signals of weakness that the US is ready to exploit. Already there is talk of buying off Pakistan’s nuclear assets a la Ukraine style – and one has to wonder whether the proclivity for profit that pervades our ruling elites has ever been a factor on this count. Mumbai has also offered another opportunity to the US to target the ISI and eventually the Pakistan army. Nevertheless, now that the US design has come into the open, let us hope our rulers will realise that the US is not an ally anymore, but an increasingly hostile state.
Which brings one to the second ‘deterrent’ for India – that of the Pakistan government surrendering to all their demands. This is why so many of us are perturbed – given the record of appeasement to India that has afflicted our leaders from January 2004 onwards. The US feels unless Pakistan act against certain groups within the country firmly – whatever that means in US lingo since it can also mean simply massive killings of our own people – Pakistan will collapse. However, the reality is that it is succumbing to US and Indian pressure that will lead to collapse and radicalisation. Already the erroneous policies of the US war on terror are shrinking the space for moderates in most Muslim polities including Pakistan. Giving in to Indo-US diktat can also result in a disconnect in civil-military relations, which will again benefit those seeking the destruction of Pakistan.
So what can Pakistan do? Certainly it is not in Pakistan’s interests to have opposition leaders refer to Pakistan as a ‘failing state’ simply to spite the government. At the risk of being repetitive, our rulers have to distinguish between state and government and not spite the former to get at the latter. But Pakistan can certainly take some immediate actions that will send the right determined signals of intent.
To begin with, we need to start moving our forces away from the western border – not simply making statements but actually moving on the ground – unless the US immediately changes its policy on the Pakistan-India question. Such a move will immediately alter our own environment for the better in the tribal belt and Pakhtunkhwa province, especially if our military moves out of these areas also. We also need to express our inability to receive US military and political leaders for some time – Mullen should never have been given the access he has had ad nauseum.
This is the first time that in a crisis situation, we have failed to send credible envoys to friendly countries like China, Iran and the Muslim world. In fact, we have taken no diplomatic initiatives at all – instead, very questionably, in the Mumbai aftermath, we chose to prevent our allies from rallying around us in the UN Security Council. Are we deliberately seeking to let our case go be default internationally or is this simply one more sign of the government’s ineptness? Finally, we need to show our military preparedness for any surgical strikes by India – on this count there should be no ambiguity – which means missiles and airplanes should be on high alert and visibly so. Neither side can risk a war, but lack of clarity can allow the other side an adventurism that we cannot afford.
Normally one would also have suggested a special session of parliament to give a national consensus to a firm Pakistani position, but having seen the fate of the APC resolve and parliament’s consensus on terrorism, one knows that using such consensus purely as window dressing loses its purpose and done often enough will only make such consensus-seeking devices a sad farce.
It is time the political leadership stopped focusing on political favours and set about more critical tasks at hand. Simply giving in to external demands to buy time for destroying institutions through corruption and nepotism will destroy the state quite effectively from within – without any Indian surgical strikes or US pressure. Or is that the real intent of the rulers?
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Excellent article.
Shireen you are a wondeful writer and a patriot.
I love you for speaking the truth and for using your skills and intellect for a noble cause to defend your country.
I thank God there are still people like you in academia/literati that not everyone is like those Indian agents like Parvez Hoodwink-boy, Anathema Jahangir and Ahmed Rashid. Such people should be sent packing to their real homes: India
If only there were Pakistanis with loyalty to Pakistan, ability, intellect and conviction like you in the Government, then we wouldn’t have to worry about treachery.
Pakistan must take a robust stand and not flinch in the face of Indian-American sabre-rattling. If they want war Pakistan, all of the 172 million people must be prepare for war now. If Pakistan lets it slide like it has with American aggression with drone attacks and the ground assault in September, then the enemy will be further emboldened.
Pakistan must defend itself at all costs. It is better to live a day as a lion than a week as a hyena.
Yes, Pakistan must immediately move all our forces on the Afghan border toward the east and tell America to go to Jahannum. We should trust our own people in FATA and Pakhtunkhwa to defend our borders from our enemies which they have done for centuries without anyone’s acknowledgement.
All Pakistanis must take up civil defence exercises, and Pakistani women especially should be trained to use weapons because those Indian rapists defiled, abducted and killed many Muslim women during Independence in 1947 and they have been doing the same in Indian Occupied Kashmir for the last 60 years.
Also if Indians invade Pakistani airspace again, their Hindu butts must be shot down. If they try for surgical strikes, then Pakistan should perform surgical strikes on New Delhi and Benares.
This bowing to India and America in submission is unacceptable to all red-blooded Pakistanis.
We the Pakistani people cannot accept appeasement of India and America with Crook Zardari waving a piece of paper like Neville Chamberlain. It will lead to our destruction. It is time all the people woke up and stop thinking that all will be ok and the ‘ho jai ga’ attitude must end immediately
It is time for the people to come together and face the enemy head-on. It is time for Pakistanis to take charge of their own destiny like they were in charge before 9/11.
It is time for the military to do what they always did in the past, fight their enemy to defend the territorial integrity of our nation and never be involved fratricide. They need to show leadership like they always did and if the Zionist-American-Indian pimp Zardari does not listen, he needs to sent packing to his wife’s Manhattan flat or her Surrey mansion. If he cannot fight Pakistan’s corner which is what he swore an oath to do, then Pakistanis don’t want his sorry, ugly, weak, incompetent, treacherous and inarticulate a*se in Government.
All those people with an ounce of Pakistani honour and pride need to demand action from the Government, with massive rallies to demand strong action against India.
Pakistan must warn it enemies that it will use EVERYTHING in its power if it is attacked in any way, and Pakistan should put this warning into effect if, or rather when, it is attacked.
Pakistanis should fear only God and not imperial has-beens like America or third-rate Imperial wanna-bes like India. Plenty of countries have survived without kow-towing to Zionist America e.g. Cuba, post-1979 Iran, Venezuela, North Korea, Syria and others. America is not God (naudhubillah) and India is nothing.
Pakistanis should have faith in God and themselves. Look at the example of Vietnam and Afghanistan in defeating ‘Super-powers’ let alone third-raters like India. A small force like Hizbollah in Lebanon clearly defeated Israel in 2006. (Israel failed in both its stated objectives in this war: to destroy Hizbollah and to stop Hizbollah rockets coming into Israel. On the other hand, Hizbollah resisted and killed many IDF occupiers and drove the rest of the pathetic, much-hyped, American-equipped soldiers who were shown totally stunned and defeated on camera. They also continued raining rockets on Israel.)
Pakistanis should take heart and not be defeatist. We are 172 million, nuclear capability or no nuclear capability.
May God Almighty Protect Pakistan and defeat the mushriqeen.
Woman should not allowed write. Shireen and andaleeb better for you to raise kids. They need you. Please go your home and leave thinking and deciding-making to us males who provide for your food through jobs and hardwork too.
A well balanced assessment as expected from Dr. Shireen. There is much hue and cry over the remarks made by India’s Minority Affairs Minister Mr. A.R. Antuley demanding a thorough enquiry into the circmstances of the death of Mumbai ATS Chief Mr. Hemant Karkare on the night of 26/11. One has to remember that this honest officer was responsible for cracking such high profile cases as the Samjhauta train blast and other terrorist strikes in India including in a Muslim majority city, Malegaon near Mumbai. He was instrumental in bringing out the complicity of retired and serving army personnel in some of the terror incidents in the country. Through his efforts, he was able to prove the links of a Sadhvi (female Hindu saint) later arrested with some of the political big wigs belonging to the BJP (a Hindu fundamentalist party) and serving army officers based in the Military Academy at Bhonsly (near Pune) who supplied material and other resources to the Hindu terrorist who conducted terror strikes in various parts of the country.
There is lurking doubt in the minds of ordinary Indians about the circumstances of the death of Mr. Hemant Karkare…as he was under the scanner of Hindu fundamentalists ever since he got arrested 11 retired and serving army officials and including Sadhvi Pragya.
Now, with a new terror law in place in India, it is becoming increasingly becoming difficult for Muslims to breathe in this surchared atmosphere.
On the other hand whatever leverage that Pakistan had vis-a-vis India, has gone down the drain…thanks to the elevation of people like Gilani and Zardari to the posts of PM and President respectively. Pakistani nation deserves much!
Let us hope that the Army Chief Kayani keeps up the pressure that he has exerted on a couple of occasion to make them (the civilian leadership) responsive to the needs of the situation.
Kindly read this interesting article by Aditi Munot, “http://muslimindiablog.blogspot.com/2008/12/acceptable-deaths.html”, though the same is not specifically about Mumbai blast but the anology is quite interesting.
arif
Dr Shireen M Mazari,
Well come here on this panel. Nice to find your concise and clear description of situation that Pakistan is confronted with today.
India; while she may carry out air strikes in Azad Jammu and Kashmir, this may serve her two aims:
• To carry out US-CIA drone type air strike on Pak military second echelon locations like Hajira, Bandi Abbas pur, Bagh and Muzaffarabad in AJK. Create a chaos and provoke PAF strikes thus heighten and concoct a pretext to further build up—an all out war scenario.
• Under the same pretext carry out strikes in AJK northern area; destroying the communication structure like bridges, tunnels etc and thus choke and block/ cut the Sah-Rah-e-Rashem ( Silk Route) highways connections between Pakistan and China.
To isolate and declare Pakistan a terrorist country is the sole aim of this Indo-US adventurism which is currently unfolding in its first phase. This will certainly make Pakistan armed forces spread on all the frontiers— very thinly. Unfortunately Pakistan is already in grip of CIA covert attacks by the traitor groups like Tehrik e Taliban Pakistan (Baitullah Masood and Fazullah groups) and others.
After a wide spread anarchy and destruction; the ultimate aim to
de-nuclearise Pakistan under the pretext that the nuclear assets may not fall in terrorist hands; very conveniently this second phase may be executed ( may be under UNO authorisations also which might be sought by then by US, Europe and India against Pakistan.).
Although we are facing a precarious situation and in the presence of a non functional government of Asif ali zaradr; that its lacks wisdom and vision and are proving themselves a bunch of total nincompoop stooges; there is a dire need of some courageous and valiant leader for Pakistan. In any case there is no option but to fully support the present government. Stay united and strive hard cum pray to come out of these ordeals— winning.
http://muslimindiablog.blogspot.com/
Dr Sahiba Welcome on TPS
regards
Akram Khan on December 26th, 2008 :
“Woman should not allowed write. Shireen and andaleeb better for you to raise kids. They need you. Please go your home and leave thinking and deciding-making to us males who provide for your food through jobs and hardwork too.”
Spoken like a true, irate Indian! You don’t fool anybody by taking a Muslim moniker and masquerading as a Muslim. If you were Muslim and literate, you would know that acquiring education and knowledge of every kind is mandatory for men and women in Islam which you’d know from having read The Noble Qur’an and the Authentic Ahadeeth.
And please don’t patronise me (or Dr.Mazari). We all think and make our own decisions. No one needs diktats and pontification from a faux Pakistani.
And who’s “us”? You don’t provide for me; God provides and then I myself provide for myself. Really get over it.
Dr.Shireen M Mazari , very welcome. We all would like you to be here with precious, well caclulated and balanced articles. Your presence here will also keep the historical record straight and updated
of called great logical historians who visit here.
Khokhar Sahib , Andaleeb Sahiba, Arif Sahib What do you Say ?
Unfortunately it appears Pakistan is pissing in its pants and getting Saudi, China and US to get India to cool down.
My god shireen! I must say we should strictly forbid and debarr women’s to float their ideas so to decide our future and war strategies relating to sovereignty and integrity .
Why don’t you pay attention on ever changing political discussion and lollypop politics in Pakistan rather to float your notion as input and suggestion in lieu of war tactics and principle of governance?
Though it was too impressive to have your name on the desk but your proposal are reflecting a habitual unroofed and unpolished vertical sin that would serve the purpose of foe and self-inflicted incisions.
My dear you must know the fact that from now and onward you and me can not just set aside by moving and stay away from our western borders.
Our western borders are now and onward as essential and mandatory caprice as our eastern borders and our presence on the same pole preludes and effaces our survival in that region so to keep away our all-time enemy India from further entry in to the premise from that region.
Bunches of miscreant terrorist as Taliban are not at all a prime objective of our presence that holds our stay on western saloon but the actual realm is a threat that was perishing as Indian role of agencies which was stumping behind all scenes.
Its sounds very authoritative to recall and divert our deter forces toward Indian move but the ground reality is we need similar deterrence on the same bay as well since alleys are poking our valleys so to surround and confiscate us from western border as well.
Under the rule of such threat technically we can not submit our departure from western border in any case.
Now to plea our case through the dominion of Security Council is again an unrealistic self denial suggestion.
One need to be credible enough to his word before his speech as verdict can be assimilated.
Why do you have to grant souls to Security Council hence to decide our shelf life and living in terms of survival.
Do you still think and thriving same opinion that your foe will stand to guard you in need of dire requirement.
You people need to get out of this conceptual misnomer of Muslim world and friendly nations.
No country with any relative ties can withstand the slogan of impeachment on the issue of declaration as terrorism. And similar push to disown the veto is a current example of attitude towards remains by our all time friends even.
Your people fanatic wrong religious conduct encased and enacted the belief and attitude of international community especially our friendly nations which was cashed by agencies like RAW so to derange relation between our friendly nations.
As far as surgical strike in Pakistan with relation to Indian adventurism and incursion is concerned, whatever is being in conductivity as Indian slogan, is on and at the behest and behalf of American version of thoughts and motives and why shouldn’t I believe that it wont be Indian planes that would strike Pakistan but similar gestures of American drones that would strike us, this time from the road map and route of India.
However to preannounce and warn the service provider India as relay station of American desire ,any such incursive move would be penalize with penalty for future forbidding, if at all such dreadful and malicious intent would be imposed on us .
Dr Shireen I assure you there is no ambiguity over repelling at strike and if at all designed destiny is put as fate on us, I don’t see bright future for intruder as well. Regards
“Andaleeb, you want to shot down Hindu butts of the fighter pilots, good thought why don’t you do it with your own hand. About the rape thing while migration after independence, people from both the sides suffered. So stop talking about separation if you are not ready to look at history properly.”-
Dear Mr/Ms. Indian, I understand your loyalty to your country but please know that if your country launches an attack on Pakistan, it is the duty of ALL its people to defend their freedom, their lives, their land and their airspace from Indian aggressors which means shooting down them down. If Pakistan was instigating such an attack, you Indians would expect and demand nothing less either!
Regarding rape, whilst a degree of it may occur in most conflicts, any honest person, historians and all Muslims know about the systematic rape of Muslim women by Hindus and especially by their servile Sikh donkeys in 1946/47 when they raped, killed and abducted thousands of Muslim women in order to spread terror and also to empty out such Muslim-majority areas like Ferozepur and Gurdaspur (which were then unjustly awarded to India at independence).
Like in Bosnia by the Serbs-Croats, the systematic rape of Muslim women in the dying days of the Raj was a deliberate policy of Hindu-Sikhs as part of their physical and psychological war-fare on Muslims and Pakistan. This fact is well recognised in history books, in first and second source accounts by witnesses, and in some cases by a few victims who survived to to speak of the brutality. It has also been written about in fiction including in the works of people like Sadaat Hassan Manto.
It is even verified by archives of the anti-Pakistan and pro-Indian BBC, which broadcasted a series of programmes in Aug 2007 to mark the 60th anniversary of the independence of Pakistan and India. In this programme of the pro-Indian BBC, even several Hindu-Sikhs acknowledged the crimes of their people against Muslims generally and against women especially. One such man gave a graphic and horrific account of how his fellow Hindu-Sikhs went an attacked a primary school full of Muslim girls, dragged them out, tore off their clothes and one by one, gang-raped them. He said he was so ashamed of this brutality that he couldn’t even look in their direction whilst they were doing this. I believe most of these were killed afterwards or abducted. This man was one of the few honest ones because he said that he knew that they did the Muslims great injustices. This was just one event described on pro-Indian British TV, but it was a microcosm of a story repeated many times and afflicting mostly Muslims.
There was also another Sikh man who looked about a 100 years old and he was proudly boasting
of how man f****** Muslims he had killed and decapitated with his sword (he was even showing his moves with his hands and arms) during Independence, how he was so proud of it and how he would do it again if he had the opportunity. This craggy, hideous, evil, low-life with one foot in the grave despite having so much blood on his wrinkly hands, had showed no remorse. He was cursing, abusing and swearing away.
There was one other Indian, a Hindu man who lived in Lahore before independence and even he admitted that Muslims were treated so badly whilst he was growing up before 1947 and then during independence struggle that it wasn’t surprising that Muslims wanted to live independently in their own state. He accepted that they were never treated well in the so-called ‘Raj’ and most likely wouldn’t have been if they’d been under an ‘Indian state’. The lot of Indian Muslims (and of Christians, Buddhists, Sikhs, Dalits and others) in India demonstrates that this perfectly.
I did not make this up, you can probably get hold of the programme from the anti-Pakistan and anti-Islam BBC who would never speak the truth where they could hide it. But in this, even they couldn’t because the truth was so glaringly undeniable and the injustices were largely one sided, with Hindu-Sikhs combining to decimate many Muslims.
“Andaleeb, how about you coming to India, I will show you what exactly happens here. About your point of Kashmir’s people you need to come and see their misery with your own eyes, that reason for this happening is your country. If they would not have sent terrorist in India, these guys would have lived happily. And about the rape thing, what about the Kashmiri pundits? They were raped, tortured and killed, by the so called freedom fighters of Kashmir. Both the countries have seen fight for freedom, but this never happened then.” - Indian
Dear Mr/Ms Indian, with the greatest of respect to you personally (as I’m sure you’re a nice person otherwise), I have no interest in coming to India when it is clearly an enemy of my country and wishes it great harm as shown by the Mumbai Fraud and other Indian engineered ‘terrorist atrocities’.
Unlike a few ‘dishonourable’ Pakistanis with no sense of decency, pride or honour (e.g some entertainers and sportsmen), I wouldn’t set foot in India whilst it’s still occupying Muslim Kashmir and while it’s instigating terrorism in Baluchistan, FATA, Sindh and Punjab and whilst it’s committing terrorist acts in its own territory and then trying to frame Pakistan for it
With respect, you need to understand and ADMIT the reality that the “misery” of Muslim Kashmiris in Indian Occupied Kashmir is caused by India illegally annexing a Muslim majority state that was a part of Pakistan by the very principle of the division of the ‘British Raj’ i.e. of Muslim majority areas being in Pakistan and Hindu-majority areas being in India. You need to acknowledge that it is the 1 million Indian troops of occupation who’re killing and raping Muslim Kashmiris that are causing “misery”. It is not Pakistan.
Deny it all you want as most Indians do (except sane voices like Arundhati Roy), but the Kashmiri insurgency against Indian occupation is indigenous, is rooted in Kashmir and it is based on actual grievances. Whilst Pakistan offered moral, and in some cases in the past, materiel support for its people and brethren in Indian Occupied Kashmir, it is not the cause of the conflict; it is India!
It results from a historical crime and injustice perpetrated byHindu-Sikhs and the British which even cunning Nehru had admitted redressing by holding a plebiscite as demanded by the 1948 UN Resolution on Kashmir.
Even intransigent Nehru agreed that the Kashmiri people should and would decide if they joined India or Pakistan. If your country was a democracy and had a real ‘case’, why has it refused to hold a plebiscite for the last 60 years? Because it knows the truth: that Kashmir is a rightful part of Pakistan, that Kashmiris want to be with Pakistan and that is why they fly Pakistani flags on 14 Aug and fly black flags on 15 Aug.
Quite apart from Indian Occupied Muslim Kashmir, in India itself there are more than 100 separtist insurgencies raging as we type. Do you mean to blame Pakistan for those too? Do the Nagas, Assamese, Sikkimese, Bihari and all the other motley crew of opponents of India not have any real grievances against India either? Are they the fault of Pakistan too? No they’re not because they are all indigenous to India, hence the fault lies with India.
@Aamir
No one is “p*%&ing their pants, I can’t speak for Mr. Zardari but the Pakistani people and armed forces sure aren’t and that is who counts!
@Saleem Sahib
I think you’re right Saleem Sahib, I agree.
Hi, this is Rajan from India. This indeed is wonderful article. Being an Indian I could see probably for the first time another side of story and concerns that average Pakistani carries. We in India are equally annoyed with our leadership as probably most of Pakistanis are. Having said so, why cant Pakistani feel our feelings, i wonder and fail to understand. India is strong nation in terms of economy and military we all know, but what purpose will war with Pak solve. It will only push us back few years, we all understand. But people in Pak should understand that we are pushed for war by your own army and ISI by fuelling terrorism. Deeds of International community of course are always governed by their own interests, we all must understand. US was ally of PAK till it suited them and today it stands with India. Same holds good for China, who eventually may not turn out to be as reliable as Pakistan thinks. Our problems are to be solved by us only and we must accept that. Our problem as of today is ISI sponsored terrorism. Indian state has been on war for way too long. Patience is running out with people of India. Like people in Pakistan, we have people in India ready to fight till last drop of blood.
War or peace, choice we have to make.
Saleem,
I have already welcomed Dr. Shireen (#5). I had the opportunity to see her many a time on TV. She is a patriot and as always she has presented very candid n balanced views in her article here. I thanks her once again for that and say that she is very much well come here.
We are supposedly in a state of war with India and I can sense that there is lot of intrusion here on this site form our Indian participants. I can see that few Indian men and women pop up here disguised as Muslims (with Muslim names). I must request them that they are very well come here but must keep their original identity. This will serve the purpose of their discussion more positively.
Regards
@@@@@@@ Andaleeb says
“”Yes, Pakistan must immediately move all our forces on the Afghan border toward the east and tell America to go to Jahannum.”"”
What a suggestion!!!! PLZ DO IT.
Taliban gets time to REGROUP.
They infiltrate in SETTLED AREAS.
A open invitation to AN AMERICAN INVASION.
All investments DRY UP
and ANDALEEB will have no option other than SELLIND ANDA.(egg).
Mouth-watering prospect.
@@@@@@@ Andaleeb says
“”like those Indian agents like Parvez Hoodwink-boy, Anathema Jahangir and Ahmed Rashid. Such people should be sent packing to their real homes: India”"”
Wow!….yes yes plz SEND them to INDIA.
A physicist like parvez hoodboy will ENRICH OUR UNIVERSITIES.
Also ASMA JAHANGIR will give medha pathakar a helping hand!!……………NOTHING CAN BE BETTER.
Andaleeb
“”"”"”Even intransigent Nehru agreed that the Kashmiri people should and would decide if they joined India or Pakistan. If your country was a democracy and had a real ‘case’, why has it refused to hold a plebiscite for the last 60 years? Because it knows the truth: that Kashmir is a rightful part of Pakistan, that Kashmiris want to be with Pakistan and that is why they fly Pakistani flags on 14 Aug and fly black flags on 15 Aug.”"”"”"”"
A perfect UN-EDUCATED MULLAH selling or hatching ANDA(eggs) here………..
listen ANDALEEB……….U need a GOOD DOSE OF HISTORY
Andaleeb
Here comes HISTORY
Kindly read PART 2 of the UN RESOLUTION on kashmir………….
PAKISTAN did NONE of the following at 1948.
PART II
TRUCE AGREEMENT
Simultaneously with the acceptance of the proposal for the immediate cessation of hostilities as outlined in Part I, both Governments accept the following principles as a basis for the formulation of a truce agreement, the details of which shall be worked out in discussion between their Representatives and the Commission.
1. (l) As the presence of troops of Pakistan in the territory of the State of Jammu and Kashmir constitutes a material change in the situation since it was represented by the Government of Pakistan before the Security Council, the Government of Pakistan agrees to withdraw its troops from that State.
Question1.Did the Government of Pakistan removed its forces from Kashmir as per UN Resolution of 1948?
(2) The Government of Pakistan will use its best endeavor to secure the withdrawal from the State of Jammu and Kashmir of tribesmen and Pakistan nationals not normally resident therein who have entered the State for the purpose of fighting.
Question 2.So The UN agreed that pashtun tribals who were not a part of kashmir were fighting along with army regulars.Do u agree?
(3) Pending a final solution the territory evacuated by the Pakistan troops will be administered by the local authorities under the surveillance of the Commission.
Question 3.When the UN commission decided that Indian forces are to be kept to maintain minimum law and order did Pakistan vacate POK or Azad Kashmir as per insrtuctions of the United Nations?
The UN RESOLUTION had three parts……..
PART 1…………….CEASE-FIRE ORDER(thus LOC was created)
PART2……………..TRUCE AGREEMENT(removal of pakistani tribesmen and troops)
PART3……………..PLEBISITE………….
Now read PART 3………………
PART III
The Government of India and the Government of Pakistan reaffirm their wish that the future status of the State of Jammu and Kashmir shall be determined in accordance with the will of the people and to that end, UPON ACCEPTANCE OF THE TRUCE AGREEMENT* both Governments agree to enter into consultations with the Commission to determine fair and equitable conditions whereby such free expression will be assured.
*pakistan DID NOT accept the truce agreement……….hence PLEBISITE was SIMPLY IMPOSSIBLE………
http://www.kashmiri-cc.ca/un/sc13aug48.htm
This proves PAKISTAN is RESPONSIBLE for current kashmir problem…………..
SM a very thoughtful article as ever indeed.
And for the comment above please read and quote the whole resolution.
It can be read here,
http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/RESOLUTION/GEN/NR0/047/72/IMG/NR004772.pdf?OpenElement.
or accessed through the UNSC website very easily.
What has India done on its part. Atleast 6 articles of this resolution talk about India ensuring a free and fair plebiscite in the region. You didnt do crap.
Pakistan is built on the principles of lies and coward act, which is what madrassas’s teach to poor Pakistanis and ask them to follow it as a duty of Islam. One doesn’t need to teach the history of coward Pakistan, its history speaks…..but the problem is madrassas’s should be aligned to teach what Pakistan is and what it is going to be in future if it takes the path of violence ( I guess that is what altered madrassas’s Islamic text preaches to kill islam in near future)
How trustworthy is pakistan to share the information, pakistan army attacked during kargil and your politicians said it was kashmir separatist to hide the truth.
Today Pakistan politicians and other pakistani personnel’s are giving confusing information on the identity of the lone surviving terrorist captured by india (I guess pakistan would go to extent to say Faridkot of Okara district doesn’t belong to Pakistan if Kasaba is proved…shame). Also why should india share the information which could be used by Pakistan to destroy the evidence itself (Already Pakistan removed the information of terrorist ‘Kasaba’ from their national database).
Pakistan is cornered and world knows ‘Pakistan is a terrorists Nation’ (US knows better than any other as it was its brain child in the early days of cold war). Pakistan is in a state of “Eating one’s own dog food’. It is time for Pakistan to clean up the mess if it needs to understand what a “Peace” is! (not possible as Pakistan army itself is a terrorists army).
Please don’t jump into conclusion I am instigate to a verbal altercation. Please put your common sense to a little use, if Pakistan is able to attack india and take Kashmir, it would have done long before. Coward act of Pakistan army was to create Kashmir separatists and make world to believe it (which failed miserably). Now Pakistan is saying Kasaba is not a Pakistani (let down of your own coward person who killed innocent un-armed men/women/children) to be proved later by world indeed he is/was a Pakistani. One great appreciation for your fellow Pakistanis is that when Nawaz Sharif spelled the truth that Kasaba is from Pakistan, you people didn’t offend saying sharif is not a Pakistani (but if world nations were to be fools, you Pakistanis would have fooled the world altogether saying Nawaz Sharif is a Indian and a RAW agent against Pak).
Please come out of your shell and look around to know where Pakistan stands in this world.